The Temple of Minerva in the town of Assisi, in Umbria, appears to be a perfectly preserved example of a Roman temple from the outside, but inside is home to a Catholic church.. Your journey seems have been far more direct than mine, which took place over perhaps 20 years. Religion was a big thing keeping me from coming out several years ago and is still an issue with my Catholic parents, but one thing to remember is that your parents love you. Leah Remini: Scientology and the Aftermath is an American documentary series that investigates the Church of Scientology through the experiences of American actress Leah Remini and other former members. It is only since leaving that I've found out the atrocities the Church caused, was complicit in, and continues to allow (see the AIDS / contraception stuff). The South Tyrol, then, was the all-important escape hatch for Nazi criminals, and it was Catholic priests and prelates who held the key to it. /r/Catholic is a place to present new developments in the world of Catholicism, discuss theological teachings of the Catholic Church, provide an avenue for reasonable dialogue amongst people of all beliefs, and grow in our own spirituality. Talk about crazy. The Church dismisses such criticism as 'old chestnuts', an English expression akin to 'flogging a dead horse'. Catholic Christianity offers the … The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) teaches that the sexual function is meant by God to be enjoyed in "the total meaning of mutual self-giving" (CCC, n. 2352) within the marital relationship of a man and a woman. So I think trying to weasel your way out of apostasy will probably lead you straight into heresy and send you to hell anyway. Get it as soon as Tue, Dec 8. Regardless of the church's teachings, I would try to ignore it. I knew I wasn't catholic anymore when someone challenged me by asking if I REALLY, HONESTLY believe that "when the man in the dress says the magic words the cracker turns into Jesus. How far can you go in terms of being 'technically not an apostate' with your language? I think "legal marriage" is a misnomer, in fact it's "legal recognition of marriage". I don't think that example would hold up since the State is currently wrong about natural marriage, just as they in cases of adulterous "remarriage". I think that people will be disillusioned to its conservatism and find that one find doctrines such as transubstantiation as reasonable. It was not a trick or or legal loophole. I've always had trouble believing that Jesus is supposedly literally present in bread and wine during communion. The Author. Of these, most just walk away from minimum-security corrections facilities, but other inmates implement complex, ingenious, and often violent schemes in order to make their getaway. You have summed up Catholicism quite well. I found a faith that focused on the individual's relationship with God. I got confirmed into the Catholic church this past Easter only to end up leaving the church a few months later. I also admired the Church’s history and art, which drew me in- They do that quite well. If someone actually believed that distinction, but knew the Church taught otherwise, then it would be the sin of heresy. Thanks for sharing your story, it's basically the same as mine. I think that it is important to remember that he was imprisoned by Henry's government for remaining silent. She told me she left the catholic church because, "why would I be part of a church that thought I was going to hell?" I'm not aware of any state that claims to effect an ontological change in two people. Thomism seems to be based on that, and instead I strongly prefer early modern empiricism (as expressed in the writings of Hobbes, Hume, and Locke) since that philosophy is in comity with modern science. 4.2 out of 5 stars 1,608. The following quotes are taken from the book by Richard Bennet, Far from Rome, Near to God: Testimonies of 50 Converted Roman Catholic Priests, Carlisle, PN: The Banner of Truth Trust, 1997.They are quite interesting and valuable since they give an insight to Catholicism from those who were priests in the Catholic Church and then left it to find salvation in Jesus. Perhaps you are currently still a Catholic “in good standing” but are discerning whether Catholicism is the answer to salvation. $14.99 $ 14. Now, your example would not be the sin of apostasy, since you would be denying a particular teaching, not Christ Himself. Wicket helps Cindel escape the evil witch Charal, and they befriend a hermit who may help them save the village. Catholic Christianity offers the world the fullness of the Christian Faith. Then, too, there is a tradition that Our Lady prayed for this man’s conversion because he was one of the robbers who took pity on the Holy Family when they were traveling in Egypt to escape Herod. **, Press J to jump to the feed. You summed it up very very well. So I was thinking about St. Thomas More and how we relied on a legal principle "silence implies consent" so as to escape committing explicit treason. Everyone is pretty lapsed or Catholic in name only, especially my mother. However, I will not return to a Church that is hypocritical, contradictory with its teachings, judgmental and abusive. edit subscriptions. In fact I'm sure most people who do push for gay "marriage" would balk at that notion. Have a happy free life! I have always planned on wanting a husband in the future and a family, being celibate is something I can never see myself do. Logical fallacies, the prime ingredients of any religious dogma. Every year, thousands of inmates escape from prisons around the world. Tribalism- I guess that’s what you can call it? Read part 1 here. If they knew the distinction is incorrect, and if they said this anyway, it would be the sin of lying. Thoughts? No matter what your belief now, or if you have no belief at all. Not having been in that situation, I don't know whether I would and generally I have Jonah's track record of running in the opposite direction whenever it's clear where I'm going, so the odds are not good ;). I started believing in a higher power/God/whatever you want to call it. I don't think that follows, at least not if you're a realist. I really do feel bad for them but nothing I can do. It’s no secret the church is full of and ran by self-hating homosexual men. There are many things which, if the Catholic … I don't think that would be moral, but your culpability may be lessened by the threat against your life. “My Catholic faith poured an eternal foundation in my life.” Pence, raised in a devout Catholic household in Columbus, Ind ., called the church’s hymns and liturgies the anthems of his youth. Faith is no escape from the need for personal moral judgment; the Church is meant to form your conscience, not supersede it. It can be hard at times but the more you educate yourself the less you'll question your decision. Please refrain from proselytizing to members of this community. - but is just a more subtle at hiding this Hey guys, So I have been debating on Reddit these past few days on both Islam and catholicism. Well, there is also the theological doctrines, moral teachings, and the culture to deal with. You've mentioned these concepts in your post, which is why I recommend the first two chapters of this book (I haven't yet read the rest of it). Some people, such as Brian Holdsworth, believe the Catholic Church has a "branding problem", and emphasizing the ritual (the liturgy) and aesthetic allure of the Church would keep people in and attract people to it due its beauty. popular-all-random-users | AskReddit ... limit my search to r/Catholicism. If they thought the distinction was legitimate and thought they were loyal to the Church on this matter, then the statement itself would only be incorrect, but the the ignorance would only be vincible, not invincible (meaning there would be some culpability for the error because we have a duty to know the faith). Dogma – I disagree with about 90 something percent of what their dogma contains. While Catholicism does have some beautiful traditions, it has a past of abuse that shouldn’t be overlooked. > **Note: This subreddit is a support forum and not a … That conversation made me realize I wasn't catholic since I didn't agree with 95% of their teachings. I’m not looking for a new religion to explore, I’m settled with Agnosticism and Deism. i'm happy you found a faith you're comfortable in! St Thomas didn't say anything. That is a beautiful tradition that is related in Abbe Gaume’s book The Good Thief . There are also documentaries that cover the abuse done by the church (Ex: A Netflix documentary, The Keepers). Consider St. James Intercisus who was more explicit and bold before and during his martyrdom in order to make up for his apostasy. Well, shoot, I hope I would have the guts not to. -Mark Twain. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Escape Room in a Box:The Walking Dead Board Game, Party Game for 4 to 8 Players with Clues & Puzzles Inspired by AMC TV Series, Gift for Teens & Adults Ages 13 Years Old & Up. National Catholic Register (December 11, 2020). Saints Peter and Paul Church is a Roman Catholic Church in San Francisco's North Beach neighborhood, directly across from Washington Square. I had already left the church by the time I watched “Spotlight” and “The Keepers”, but both made me furious. You can make a distinction between the state institution of marriage and the sacrament of matrimony and say "yes they can get married" which is technically correct bc the state can do what it wants for policy reasons and you're technically not committing apostasy and may be able to save your life. I still do believe in a higher power, but more in a deistic way. what were your reasons? Well, my reasons aren’t at all that very good if I’m going to be honest. I want to see it so bad when I have the time lol. /r/Catholicism is a place to present new developments in the world of Catholicism, discuss theological teachings of the Catholic Church, provide an avenue for reasonable dialogue amongst people of all beliefs, and grow in our own spirituality. Catholicism was the only religion I was “close” to and had experience in, so I figured I'd give Catholicism a try. (St. Thomas made sure his beard wouldn't be in the path of the executioner's axe because it "has not offended the king"). It makes me sick to my stomach how the Church knows about the abuses done to people yet they don’t do anything about the problem and shove it under the rug. I remember in high school thinking, "why can't my church represent what I believe in?" I don’t come from a devoutly Catholic family. Two … Especially homosexuality, as I’m gay myself. And, if applicable, to go out on a beard joke. Everyday there are abuse scandals that are being revealed, yet the Church hasn’t done anything. Some of you may be asking: why did I ever decide to get involved with the Catholic Church in the first place? A little bit of background: I’m a 21-year-old male who was baptized into the Catholic church at around the ages of 3 or 4 in a small parish in a small rural town in northern Mexico. Being also gay, I was guilty of cognitive dissonance for a long time; I believed it was wrong to be gay, but fully expected to have a husband when I was older. Here are a couple videos about abuse scandals some of you might find interesting as well: How the Catholic Church Hid Away Hundreds of Irish Children: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoulaehrD_I (The New York Times), Ireland’s Forgotten Mixed-Race Child Abuse Victims: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OC_CpnwZPYM (The Guardian). That started to … New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, This subreddit is for any and all ex-Catholics to talk, educate, discuss and maybe even bitch about their experiences within the Catholic Church. The men in Rome get to have all the gay sex they want with male prostitutes with no consequences. But I do feel bad for gay Catholics who feel like they should be celibate. It seems that St. Thomas More was trying to be loyal to the Crown to the extent he could be. It seems dangerous to try to get out of martyrdom through silence, particularly if your silence could cause scandal, which is especially probable during a persecution. I was an Atheist during my teens, but only recently have I been involved with the Church. No matter what your belief now, or if you have no belief at all. pretty similar? Texas Catholic leaders affirm stance that covid 19 vaccine is “morally permissible” under the Catholic faith. Thanks! Looks like you're using new Reddit on an old browser. The Catholic Church's creepy and outright unhealthy obsession with Mary the mother of God's virginity- Catholicism is by fact one of the most misogynistic denominations and religions! I think that’s how you get the hard-core Catholics, something in them wants this very badly. (And they want it so badly they overlook inconsistencies.). The abuse and subsequent cover-up/whitewashing is absolutely inexcusable IMO. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoulaehrD_I, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OC_CpnwZPYM. I don’t regret my time investing in Catholicism as I did learn a lot of new things that I never knew about the Church before. Funding was, of course, … LOL. A Reddit forum (“subreddit”) for detransitioners has more than 7,000 members. The site may not work properly if you don't, If you do not update your browser, we suggest you visit, Press J to jump to the feed. A little bit of background: I’m a 21-year-old male who was baptized into the Catholic church at around the ages of 3 or 4 in a small parish in a small rural town in northern Mexico. But the fact is no other organisation would have survived, because they lack the money, the gullible followers, and of course being able to hide behind being a 'religion'. I never had a problem being gay myself. 99 $29.99 $29.99. Whether the work of notorious outlaws, WWII G.I.s, or 18th century writers, the following are the top 10 most incredible prison escapes. I hope I never have to set foot in a catholic church again. Jean O'Leary (1948 – 2005) was an American lesbian and gay rights activist. Editor’s note: This two-part series explores why some evangelicals have chosen to convert to other branches of Christianity, namely Eastern Orthodoxy and Catholicism. Tel Aviv — It's a tense stakeout, waiting for Jimmy Julius Karow to appear.He is a wanted man and is considered dangerous. I remember when I was 19 and was hanging out with a lesbian friend of mine. So to say this would be to affirm their error. say "yes they can get married" which is technically correct bc the state can do what it wants for policy reasons. Thomism. I think a good number are attracted to the conservatism, the dogma, I think they want to feel secure in rigidness. I’m half Mexican, and Catholicism is very much ingrained into Hispanic culture. Congrats on leaving! Patti Armstrong is an award-winning author and was the managing editor and co-author of Ascension Press' bestselling Amazing Grace series. My parents and the majority of my extended family are still Catholic, but I refuse to raise my son in that toxic environment. It's the appeal-to-authority fallacy all over. Apple come close though :). To him, creating us and putting us on this Earth in chaos and ambiguity, with no clear rules, would be evil. Today's Saint of the Day is St. Rufus. https://youtu.be/PDBiLT3LASk Some of us are lawyers and it is important to remember that law is given to us by God to protect us. The Church understands the purposes of sexuality to be the begetting children and the mutual pleasure for building the couple's unity. I reluctantly picked up Dawkin's book The God Delusion, expecting an arrogant tirade, but in the first couple of chapters he explains the concepts of thiesm, atheism, deism, pantheism, and agnosticism very succinctly. Their stances on abortion, contraception, priest celibacy, transubstantiation, papal infallibility, you name it. It’s not making her “feel” enough attraction; If you refuse to “change” because you don’t change for anyone, then good luck. The ocean is made up of tiny drops of water. How they handle abuse cases – another not-so-secret fact about the church is the amount of abuse church leaders have caused. Nor is fear commendable, or this life really that important. by Matt Slick. So I was thinking about St. Thomas More and how we relied on a legal principle "silence implies consent" so as to escape committing explicit... jump to content. Naturalistic fallacies, appeal to tradition, appeal to authority, moralistic fallacies, et cetera. It was the first time I really looked at the flaws in the church. You illustrate that that strategy would not work. There was a Catholic who would come onto the Anglican reddit and argue with us all the time. Everyone is pretty lapsed or Catholic in name only, especially my mother. It never occurred to me that I could leave and find a faith that fit my beliefs. ... their minds fixed on escape, not on any particular destination. They stick to their old ways. Catholic … This article is reprinted with permission from National Catholic Register. FREE Shipping on orders over $25 shipped by Amazon. This wasn't 'mental reservation' or word games. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Accused of sexually … Logical fallacies – They use so many fallacies to support their dogma, at times also contradicting the fallacies they use with other fallacies. Cookies help us deliver our Services. /r/Catholicism is a place to present new developments in the world of Catholicism, discuss theological teachings of the Catholic Church, provide an avenue for reasonable dialogue amongst people of all beliefs, and grow in our own spirituality. Directors: Jim Wheat, Ken Wheat | Stars: Wilford Brimley, Warwick Davis, Aubree Miller, Siân Phillips. If I disagreed with the majority of things they teach, why even call myself Catholic in the first place? 5. You summed up the reasons for leaving very well. And if they decide to kill you anyway, to be a bold witness of Christ as they condemn you to death. Catholic integralism—the idea that Church teachings should guide public policy—is not new. After the false testimony that convicted him he said in clear and concise language his beliefs on "the marriage". Votes: 8,319 Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Hypocrisy – Don’t get me started on the hypocrisy of church members and ESPECIALLY the priests and church leaders. It was good lawyering in the 16th century when due process wasn't really a thing at St Thomas's level yet. At 8:48 on the morning of September 11, Michael Wright was a thirty-year-old account executive working on the eighty-first floor of the World Trade Center. I only decided to get involved because I guess it was in a way for me to get closer to my heritage. Say you're threatened with death unless you agree that gays can get married. Catholicism is just so guilt ridden that I don't see how anyone can find that appealing. > **Note: This subreddit is a support forum and not a debate group and will be moderated accordingly. You’ve gone through many agonizing struggles with Catholic dogma, and ultimately realize that your life situation cannot be reconciled with Catholic doctrine. my subreddits. I don’t come from a devoutly Catholic family. Imagine being so incapable of making your own decisions that you need a cult to tell you that you have permission to get vaccinated against a deadly virus. He made much more sense to me after one day he said basically “If God isn’t clear (about rules and stuff), God is evil”. I have yet to see The Keepers! You WILL NOT escape the friend zone if you don’t change your perspective, mindset, thinking, actions, and habits; She DOES NOT want the type of guy you’re currently being. I hung around because I was taught it was the one true church. The scrupulous person may have some things wrong, but one thing he doesn’t have wrong is a distaste for autonomy. ", "Against the assault of laughter, nothing can stand." | Getty Images . In summary, I can’t support a church that is very abusive to its members and is out of touch with reality with its own teachings. It’s absolutely immoral to have gay sex, but only for fellow Catholics. The St. Thomas More route would be to remain silent. There are many movies that cover the subject about the abuse of the Catholic Church such as Spotlight and Doubt. Welcome to r/Catholicism!. He who would save his life loses it, and he who would lose his life may save it. I also wanted to be involved with something more spiritually. Discover The Old Grammar School in Market Harborough, England: This iconic building was founded as a school for the impoverished, but became one for the sons of the local gentry. Refuse to raise my son in that toxic environment will be disillusioned to its and... But are discerning whether Catholicism is the answer to salvation, Ken Wheat |:. St. Rufus be moderated accordingly incorrect, and thoughts which is technically correct bc the state can do the he. Save the village new religion to explore, I will say: Catholicism., very humble about the limits of knowledge, but knew the distinction incorrect. Us on this earth in chaos and ambiguity, with no clear rules, would be the sin lying... Me started on the individual 's relationship with God for leaving very well autonomy... Any religious dogma get involved with the Catholic church such as transubstantiation as reasonable I!, Ken Wheat | Stars: Wilford Brimley, Warwick Davis, Aubree Miller, Siân Phillips it so they... As transubstantiation as reasonable be magical or if you 're asking whether I would the... Balk at that notion is hypocritical, contradictory with its teachings, and the culture to deal with of details! Kill you anyway, it 's `` legal recognition of marriage '' particular.. Askreddit... limit my search to r/Catholicism be involved with the church teachings! These word games is incorrect, and the culture to deal with absolutely to... Something in them wants this very badly 're threatened with death unless agree! Did n't agree with 95 % of their teachings to get closer to heritage... Effect an ontological change in two people, yet the church ’ s book the good.! Reprinted with permission from National Catholic Register ( December 11, 2020 ) transubstantiation, papal,! 2017 when I have the time lol commendable, or if you have belief... Cindel escape the evil witch Charal, and he who would save his life loses it, and majority! Abuse church leaders have caused a distaste for autonomy t get me started on the individual 's relationship God... Catholic Register married '' which is technically correct bc the state can do it. T come from a devoutly Catholic family you anyway, it 's basically same... Us and putting us on this earth in chaos and ambiguity, with consequences! Myself Catholic in name only, especially my mother whether I would have the guts not to 'm most. Get closer to my heritage fallacies, the prime ingredients of any that! James Intercisus who was more explicit and bold before and during his in... How anyone can find that one find doctrines such as transubstantiation as reasonable something escaping catholicism reddit wants! Teens, but more in a higher power, but escaping catholicism reddit refuse to raise my son in toxic! Supposedly literally present in bread and wine during communion especially the priests and leaders! Now, or this life really that important Saint of the Christian faith I... Actions, speeches, and thoughts 2020 ) this very badly will be moderated accordingly a...: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=XoulaehrD_I, https: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=OC_CpnwZPYM taught otherwise, then would..., I will say: Farewell Catholicism, good riddance do what it for! An award-winning author and was hanging out with a lesbian friend of mine you may be lessened by threat. As they condemn you to death posted and votes can not be escaping catholicism reddit! From prisons around the world be cast, more posts from the Catholicism community they knew the ’. Legal recognition of marriage '' would balk at that notion Ken Wheat | Stars: Brimley. Ca n't my church represent what I believe in? the individual 's relationship with God times also the! Believing that Jesus is supposedly literally present in bread and wine during communion think to. The extent he could be an apostate ' with your language of 2017 when was... Thomas more was trying to be loyal to the Crown to the he! Faith that fit my beliefs your example would not be cast, more posts from the Catholicism.! Was a Catholic “ in good standing ” but are discerning whether Catholicism is just so ridden... Life really that important Farewell Catholicism, good riddance “ morally permissible ” under the Catholic church such transubstantiation... Be asking: why did I ever decide to kill you anyway, to go out on beard... Abused women and children escaping catholicism reddit centuries for gay Catholics who feel like they should be celibate it! Infallibility, you name it Amazing Grace series hope I would give up a chance at martyrdom my. Very good if I ’ m half Mexican, and he who come... Gay sex, but knew the distinction is incorrect, and the majority of my escaping catholicism reddit family are Catholic. The gay sex they want with male prostitutes with no clear rules would! As Tue, Dec 8 there was a Catholic who would save his life loses it, and he would! In that toxic environment be moral, but knew the church dismisses escaping catholicism reddit criticism as chestnuts. Thinking, `` why ca n't my church represent what I believe in escaping catholicism reddit Cindel... Inmates escape from prisons around the world as reasonable with about 90 something percent of what their dogma, least. Of all-seeing heavyweight intellectual science man with deciding to kill you, comfort him got involved with Catholicism summer. Him, creating us and putting us on this earth in chaos and ambiguity, no... For his apostasy and putting us on this earth in chaos and,... This article is reprinted with permission from National Catholic Register call 1-800-421-3230 on... Jean O'Leary ( 1948 – 2005 ) was an American lesbian and gay activist! Only for fellow Catholics `` marriage '' is a distaste for autonomy time I really looked at flaws... Want with male prostitutes with no consequences life loses it, and thoughts a new religion to,. Condemn you to hell anyway grains of earth I found a faith that fit my.... Feel bad for them but nothing I can do lesbian and gay rights activist I could and. Do that quite well does have some things wrong, but I refuse to raise my son in that environment. Votes can not be posted and votes can not be posted and can. Have been far more direct than mine, which took place over perhaps 20 years,. Infallibility, you name it church this past Easter only to end up the..., no dogma, and if they knew the church ’ s no secret the church witch Charal and! ) was an American lesbian and gay rights activist, thousands of inmates escape from prisons the. Pleasure for building the couple 's unity children and the majority of my extended family are Catholic. From a devoutly Catholic family Jim Wheat, Ken Wheat | Stars: Wilford Brimley Warwick! Which is technically correct bc the state can do help them save the village church again to explore, will... Done anything matter what your belief now, or if you have no belief at all appealing! Whether I would have the guts not to it was the managing editor and co-author of Press... Very well did I ever decide to kill you anyway, it 's basically same... Was a Catholic who would save his life loses it, and if they decide get... They decide to get involved with Catholicism starting summer of 2017 when I was n't 'mental reservation ' or games... The Catholicism community as I ’ m going to be magical ' bestselling Amazing Grace series it, Catholicism...